I'll make this easy…

124# single strand for everything except double 10's/12's

150# flouro for double 10's/12's

I will fish the flouro with other baits too but never with a bulldawg, medussa or hardhead. In all honesty I like how baits behave with single strand wire instead of the flouro. I build all my flouro and tie it instead of crimps.

The only thing I ever use sevenstrand or any other stranded wire for is sucker rigs. I simply don't trust crimps for regular fishing but on a sucker rig the leader doesn't take the abuse of casting.

"vano397" said:
Would you ever consider using tieable wire for sucker rigs…or is that too much work.

It's generally much more expensive and I don't think it would be any more durable. I would consider it if they made it without any coating on it.

I have bought all the components to start building my leaders for the season. Last year I used something similar to the Du-Bro but just allowed me to do barrell wraps. I see the importance of a haywire twist before going into a barrell wrap, but didn't want to buy the Du-Bro EZ twist tool just for that. I realize it isn't that expensive, however, it seems fairly easy to do the haywire twist and barrell wraps with my hands and pliers. Is there anything I'm missing in regards to the advantages of purchasing the Du-Bro or should I just save myself $17 and buy some round nose pliers and just keep building my leaders by hand? Probably overthinking the whole damn thing, just want to make sure my leaders are solid. Thanks!

Haywire schmaywire.

If you appreciate tool design you'll agree that those Du-Bro tools are marvels. They are incredibly effective for churning out perfect straight-wire leaders. And once you get the hang of it you won't be able to buy better wire leaders than you can make for yourself. The only negative is that the tool is designed for wire less than 200# or so.

Worth every penny, took me 10 years and a zillion leaders to wear out my first one.

"vano397" said:

I am also upgrading the poundage on my flouro, I never broke any of the 80, but the extra thickness cant hurt… I actually pulled up the main cable that holds the ski course in place on murray one day with one! i guess i was searching a little too deep that day

"Ranger" said:
240# straight wire for glide baits, haywire twists

barided sevenstrand for quick-strike sucker rigs, crimpeed

80# flouro for everything else, tied and glued (I make fresh leaders for each new season)

The day my #80 flouro fails me I will seriously consider moving up to the # level recommended by Will and other experts.

You guys are freakin' nuts for using such small flouro. What's the point of an 80lb leader if you are using 80-100lb braid? Flouro is not tooth proof. I have the pics to prove it.
Ranger, I don't understand that if it's proven that 80lb doesn't hold up to muskie teeth, why wouldn't you just take someone elses word for it? I've heard of muskies being caught on 4lb test. My brother caught his first one on 12lb test. But that doesn't mean I'm going to use it until it fails. I'm going to take the advice (and use my common sense) that it's just not strong enough. The pic below is 100lb. Since that day, I have not used them again. I know they would be ok for a trolling leader, but I don't troll enough to have rods/reels/line/leaders just for trolling right now. And why would you have 80lb flouro, but 240lb steel? [smilie=eek7.gif]
If flouro is virtually invisible underwater, what the difference in using 200lb vs 80? The price? An extra $0.50 per leader?

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"vano397" said:
Jim.. this was really my first full year of muskies. I happen to have the 80 for pike leaders, and tipups, and never had an issue, so it was a use it cuz I got it thing… I have since upgraded about 50 lbs. And hope to improve lots on the coming year, also continue being prepared… before last season I used store bought wire and.had issues with snaps, so o learned past that quickly!

Awesome! [smilie=jamminz.gif] I too started with store bought. I think the biggest ones I could find at the time were 30lb from Gander Mtn. Those went into the trash after 2 uses.

"Will Schultz" said:
I'll make this easy…

124# single strand for everything except double 10's/12's

150# flouro for double 10's/12's

+1 and the only tool you really need for making wire leaders is a small round nose pliers. Make sure to wrap the wire loosely at first so it doesn't get brittle and break.

"Ranger, I don't understand that if it's proven that 80lb doesn't hold up to muskie teeth, why wouldn't you just take someone elses word for it?"

Would you believe that I have a learning disability? No? Hmmmm…….

Since I disbelieve in something imperically proven then I fall back on faith. Hmmm…not buying that either, huh? Ok…

There are examples of 80# failure, but I don't feel that 80# is proven to not hold up on a regular basis based on a limited number of failures in the field, most failures occurring with a number of variables at play. I respect the wisdome of those who are smarter and more experienced than me but I'm betting that statistically we would find that 80# and higher weights are probabaly no so far apart in frequency of failure. Testing would require a simple set up very much like the "Knot Wars" on tv. Hold all variable constant except the weight of the flouro. Both stretch and abrade it and see wat happens. I wonder if this has been done already.

But All opinions are worthwhile to consider and you've convinced me to give some bigger flouro a try this season. Let's see how the death wobble suicks and madman twitch baits like it.

I've always used Climax Flouro, Stringease snaps and good swivels. Would you guys who use heavier reccommend a different brand?

Thanks.

If you make it to the show this weekend go find John Bette from Stealth Leaders and talk with him about this. He is a really good guy and this is his business and he can give you some good no BS opinions.

I will still make leaders in small quantities if people are interested. I will make single strand or fluoro. If you want fluoro, I will crimp as I normally do, or tie if you prefer. There is an old post showing my product.

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