Fish ID project

Topics concerning muskellunge and fisheries research, diseases, stocking and management.

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tundrawalker00
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Fish ID project

Post by tundrawalker00 » Mon Feb 09, 2015 5:56 pm

All,
I sent out an e-mail today to Jim Dexter, Matt Hughes, Scott Heintzelman, Mark Tonello, Jim TenHaaf and Mike Holmes of the Michigan Darkhouse Association requesting that all involved work together to help with winter/darkhouse fish ID to protect sublegal muskies. I included a PDF produced in Minnesota in the 1990s, which I think can be improved upon.

Basically I'm asking for either a page in the fishing guide or a slick, glossy handout that helps people with darkhouse fish ID. I know the MMA is anti-kill and I support that stance, but spearing is not going away and we can't get 48s without protecting the 28s. This is a step toward that. If you would like a copy of the Minnesota handout, feel free to drop me a line at my work address below.

Brian Mulherin
bmulherin@ludingtondailynews.com

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Will Schultz
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Post by Will Schultz » Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:18 pm

Brian - Send me the pdf and I'll get it hosted so we have a link.
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Revinchev
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Post by Revinchev » Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:09 pm

Great idea Brian. Way to take the initiative.
Nick

Fishead

Post by Fishead » Tue Feb 10, 2015 7:27 am

"I sent out an e-mail today to Jim Dexter, Matt Hughes, Scott Heintzelman, Mark Tonello, Jim TenHaaf and Mike Holmes of the Michigan Darkhouse Association requesting that all involved work together to help with winter/darkhouse fish ID to protect sublegal muskies. I included a PDF produced in Minnesota in the 1990s, which I think can be improved upon."

Good idea! I hope something positive comes out of it.

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tundrawalker00
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Post by tundrawalker00 » Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:47 pm

Look, you have asshats in every crowd. There are plenty of bucks shot by spotlight every year, etc.

All you can do regulation-wise is try to write them tighter and help the people trying to follow what's on the books. Will's trying to spearhead tighter regs. I'm trying to help people follow the regs on the books, which in my mind means protecting dozens if not hundreds of muskies per lake every winter until they reach 42.

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Will Schultz
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Post by Will Schultz » Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:00 pm

Fishead - I understand your frustration but name calling and making assumptions about their intentions does NOTHING for our cause. In fact, it only adds to the already expanding divide between what they want and what we know is best for the fishery.
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Post by Brett Ladd » Tue Feb 10, 2015 2:06 pm

[quote="Will Schultz"]Fishead - I understand your frustration but name calling and making assumptions about their intentions does NOTHING for our cause. In fact, it only adds to the already expanding divide between what they want and what we know is best for the fishery.[/quote]

Agreed!

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hemichemi
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Post by hemichemi » Tue Feb 10, 2015 2:09 pm

Tightening up the regs and educating both anglers and spearers are excellent things we should be doing, but in my opinion the one critical missing piece in MI is sufficient enforcement.

Here's what Wikipedia has on the percentage of DNR monies which are spent on MI Co's: ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michigan_C ... n_Officers )

Image

Even though the DNRs budget has gone up since 2008, the amount spent on enforcement has gone down by almost $6M. Passing new regs won't help much if there're not enough COs to properly enforce them and catch the violators we all know are out there, both anglers and spearers. I fish muskies almost every weekend from May to December and since I started fishing for muskies on '08 I've been visited by a CO out on the water exactly once. According to that article there are 192 COs, not all of whom are out doing field operations. For MIs 83 counties, that's about 2 per county IF they were all policing lakes.

Perhaps MMA should lobby for increased enforcement efforts/monies. I have no idea how we might actually do that, but I think we should at least consider it.
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Will Schultz
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Post by Will Schultz » Tue Feb 10, 2015 2:28 pm

Maybe I'm missing something but I don't see how enforcement is an issue. If undersize fish are being speared no amount of CO's on duty is going to make a difference if those spearers aren't willing to educate themselves. Sure it might be in the back of their mind that maybe that's not a pike down there but is the thought that a CO on the ice really going to stop them?
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Post by tundrawalker00 » Tue Feb 10, 2015 2:32 pm

Agreed. Enforcement is a flyswatter trying to stop a snowstorm. The only reason they catch people with illegal bucks is because there's not a 6x8 hole in the ice for people to slide them in to.

We have to convince the people trying to spear that allowing the fish to grow to legal size is what's best for all of us.

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Post by hemichemi » Tue Feb 10, 2015 3:45 pm

Might stop some. If more got caught and got fined, others will think twice. Pushing a fish down the hole doesn't make it invisible. Cheap underwater cams could be used to look for undersized fish that were discarded.

I'm not claiming it's the answer to everything, but without effective enforcement, education will only change those who are willing to change. How many darkhouse fishermen are? If some are already scoffing at the regs, making tighter regs won't do any good unless they're effectively enforced. Certainly cutting funding to enforcement isn't the optimal situation.
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vano397
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Post by vano397 » Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:14 pm

Will Schultz wrote:Fishead - I understand your frustration but name calling and making assumptions about their intentions does NOTHING for our cause. In fact, it only adds to the already expanding divide between what they want and what we know is best for the fishery.
i agree but sometimes you just need a place to go to scream and throw thongs... since wives and children are not good for either of these, a private forum sometimes is!
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ricky sox wrangler
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Post by ricky sox wrangler » Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:46 pm

Instead of getting mad at the spearing crowd, maybe it's time to wonder WHY hasn't the DNR made any changes yet? It didn't just turn low density overnight. They know it's low density. WHY hasn't anything been done yet. It's such a simple minded question...WHY? It's in the hands of our DNR. Maybe we are missing something here. Somebody is.....
Rick

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Will Schultz
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Post by Will Schultz » Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:54 pm

vano397 wrote:
Will Schultz wrote:Fishead - I understand your frustration but name calling and making assumptions about their intentions does NOTHING for our cause. In fact, it only adds to the already expanding divide between what they want and what we know is best for the fishery.
i agree but sometimes you just need a place to go to scream and throw thongs... since wives and children are not good for either of these, a private forum sometimes is!
The comments were NOT made in a private forum, the comments are here in a public forum.
Someone is sitting in the shade today because someone planted a tree a long time ago.
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Will Schultz
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Post by Will Schultz » Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:58 pm

ricky sox wrangler wrote:Instead of getting mad at the spearing crowd, maybe it's time to wonder WHY hasn't the DNR made any changes yet? It didn't just turn low density overnight. They know it's low density. WHY hasn't anything been done yet. It's such a simple minded question...WHY? It's in the hands of our DNR. Maybe we are missing something here. Somebody is.....
That's a completely separate issue. This topic is concerning the mis-identification of muskies and how education could go a long way toward eliminating, or greatly reducing, the concern.
Someone is sitting in the shade today because someone planted a tree a long time ago.
- Warren Buffett

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